Star Citizen – Extinction Level Event

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  • #2916
    Dsmart
    dsmart
    Keymaster

    For some time now, the events which I believe will lead to the catastrophic collapse of the project, and which have accumulated to become the Extinction Level Event, have been in full swing.

Viewing 32 replies - 33 through 64 (of 154 total)
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  • #3060
    Dsmart
    dsmart
    Keymaster

    OK, that’s some epic level trolling right there.

    Here at PC Invasion we would love to see Star Citizen get finished, but we advise any new players not to buy into the game at this point until more of it is complete.

    #3195
    MDrake SC
    MDrake SC
    Participant

    Update #3

    Remolode returns with more. This time he is posting the letter Derek sent to the mod jester86, which was made public elsewhere. This image is the whole topic.

    And of course, they just love to harass Derek further.

    #3194
    MDrake SC
    MDrake SC
    Participant

    Oh wow, the mods are moving faster. They deleted Sledgejammer’s post. I was hoping to save this later, but I’ll post it here before the mods completely nuke it.

    Derek has been doing some fun stuff. He is going after the hate-reddit itself. Here is the thread simply about Derek’s actions, and the relevant images that were posted by Remolode that make up the original post. One, two, three.

    The moderators are scared. I wonder what the cultists will think or do… Finally accept Derek is legitimate? Or more likely say “Derek is just a liar and bully with fake lawyers.”

    #3193
    MDrake SC
    MDrake SC
    Participant

    It’s been a quiet few days for official news. On the hate-reddit though… a bit of fun has occurred.

    “Dear Derek, this subreddit exists for one reason and one reason only at its core. To document what you say. A fun byproduct of that are the numerous individuals who provide counter evidence or prove your wild accusations are in fact baseless lies.

    There is no hate here, any personal attack against you or invasion of your privacy is swiftly deleted because it is against the rules. But you know that already don’t you? After all the only person who has been banned for operating a hate sub should be familiar to you.” – Sledgejammer

    The whole thread can be found here. I don’t expect many people to go through the drivel they spew, so I’ll spoil and explain the fun.

    “Shitposting and baiting will be dealt with severely. Today has been a bad day for posting violations, keep it civil and cut down on our workload. This is your warning, do not be surprised if violations in this thread net immediate temporary or permanent bans.” – jester86 (moderator)

    The cultists are going more and more insane. They are increasing their irrational attacks, harassment, whatever and it is forcing the mods to keep things under “control.” Many comments are deleted, and warnings are issued. It is amazing to see them breaking down slowly.

    It is weird that there are “moderates” over there that are willing to join the anti-SC camp, when proof is provided, but otherwise hate Derek. Always saying what Derek has shown is not proof enough. Then they ignore official things like Chris’ response to the Escapist. Beer’s emails with Sandi and Patrick. Loss of game features. Minimal viable product.

    Just how broken are these people? Should we be worried or sorry for them? Endure their harassment and constant attacks in hopes they will understand that they have been deceived by CIG? Especially at this late stage?

    My opinion, nope. Those guys are screwed up and irredeemable. Even those “moderates.”

    The ELE is progressing slowly. The signs are all there. I just love sharing the small details.

    #3192
    Flo Ryan
    Pica
    Participant

    I wonder how much of what CR now does is really voluntarily. He wouldn’t be the first revolutionary, swept away by his own movement.

    Looking at the  non-critizens, one really would not want to cross there paths in some dark alley. When do you transit from a cult leader into a hostage of that very same cult? Maybe we should start a railroad for kickstarter prophets who over promised and now have to run from the crowd who is not to fond.

    If you sink the monetary value of a house-

    Derek was right to not state his address.

    #3184
    Backer42 Backer42
    Backer42
    Participant

    [quote quote=3178]@ Backer42
    I am kinda surprised that you had that strong of a no-BS policy and didn’t know who that woman was (at the time), and was also an original backer. I could’ve been a golden ticket holder, but since I never ever forgot just how terrible the Wing Commander movie was… I did not jump into SC right away. I kept following the original RSI news and Kickstarter, and the cringy final push video, and waited until I saw signs that the project had a chance of going somewhere, and Chris had acknowledged his past mistakes.
    Wow, Chris sure fooled me. I was seriously convinced he learned from his mistakes in the Wing Commander movie, and Freelancer with Microsoft in his interviews. I was even willing to overlook the woman who I suspected was the wife (thanks to said cringy video).[/quote]

    I never saw the Wing Commander movie. Back then in 2012 I didn’t even know it existed. I got mostly misinformed by video game media outlets, which promoted Roberts’ Kickstarter and praised him like a genius.

    When the funding campaign launched, I was positively impressed by the successful remake of the XCOM franchise, so I thought bringing back another 90s classic couldn’t hurt. I already participated in various crowdfunded games, which also turned out good.

    Of course, I expected them to bring over the good things from 90s sci-fi PC games (like diverse and customizable input controller support), not the bad things (like the excuse-tier storytelling). Turns out Descent Underground from Wingman previously working at CIG seems to be the title, which fulfills this promise, not the 120 million movie project.

    Chis’ wife only appeared inside the marketing videos and I didn’t watch those. After pledging I even canceled the email subscriptions, because the weekly mails reporting the “progress” where basically just “give us more money pls!” and my stance on that was: “Come back when you have something to download”.

    So it went downhill early on, but I wasn’t suspecting enough. I was fine with just waiting two years, of course, then there was no finished release, just Arena Commander.

    #3183
    Mtness Excelsior
    mtness
    Participant

    And now to something (not) completely different.

    I just stumbled about this nice little article: https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/what-investors-really-thinking-when-unicorn-startup-fairchild?trk=eml-b2_content_ecosystem_digest-hero-14-null&midToken=AQGT-48Jlo7eFg&fromEmail=fromEmail&ut=2IVkv8_lVMITc1

    “To anyone outside of the Silicon Valley bubble, the Theranos fallout is not only hard to believe, but hard to understand. How could a startup with nearly $100 million in funding potentially be a giant fraud? How could her investors not see the writing on the wall before the SEC started banging down the door?”

    I’m just wondering if CIG will draw the same amaount of attention, since it is not backed by VC.

    #3182
    MDrake SC
    MDrake SC
    Participant

    @ J HOW

    I am under the impression that you are now having a lot of fun with following SC. I mean, it sounds like you are a goon now. If true, kinda funny considering how you got involved.

    Anyways, I agree that CIG may be planting out false information in order to discredit us and goons. Fortunately, Derek has his sources (which he actively protects), so anything CIG does will not affect him. It will only affect those of us who are well outside of CIG’s clutches.

    I will also admit, I am slightly jealous of what you have heard. Learning of CIG staff applying for your workplace, and being denied, actually makes me happy. It’s not fun and games when someone can’t get a job. However, the fact that many people at CIG are complicit (especially LA office) in supporting this ponzi scheme certainly makes me question the moral quality of those left at CIG. Aside from sources who chose to stay as whistleblowers.

    Personally, I am very curious what kind of game company you work at, but I know you cannot tell us without endangering yourself.

    Here’s to hoping SC goes down sooner, rather than later. I really want to be wrong about my 3000 whales-survival-power analysis.

    #3180
    Lir Big
    lir big
    Participant

    @Drake

    Yeah I was a late backer , somehwere on a former blog you can see my first introducing post. What got me in, as a FPS player before everything, was Star Marine. Also interested in space genre, and was fed up with STO that was becoming so shitty back then already. I’ve really started to dig into the whole lot of overwhelming brain washing website about february-march 2015; When I saw a report about a happy proud-of-himself Chris Roberts enjoying his fracking mocap holidays at backers’s expense when everyone else thought they were working HARD on star marine. This is when my brain gone ‘what the heck’.

    As for the cultists, they will go on the wrong fight untill the end, so blind they are. As long as they’ll trust CR they won’t let go.

    #3179
    J HOW
    J HOW
    Participant

    A good point raised by one of the goons:

    It’s also worth noting if they are spending time and effort on trying to manipulate, discredit 0r twist what we are saying then that is time they are not spending on the game.

    It is a futile effort at this point but rather than spending time and resources (staff time) on Derek / SC controversy / collectively “us” wouldn’t it be more productive to use this time in fixing the engine or working on the actual game?

    Priorities at this point seem to be out the proverbial window, or rather the horse has bolted and is in the next field would be a more fitting analogy.

    It seems strange that after negative controversy they want to keep digging, wasting people’s time in the process.

    #3178
    MDrake SC
    MDrake SC
    Participant

    @ Backer42

    I am kinda surprised that you had that strong of a no-BS policy and didn’t know who that woman was (at the time), and was also an original backer. I could’ve been a golden ticket holder, but since I never ever forgot just how terrible the Wing Commander movie was… I did not jump into SC right away. I kept following the original RSI news and Kickstarter, and the cringy final push video, and waited until I saw signs that the project had a chance of going somewhere, and Chris had acknowledged his past mistakes.

    Wow, Chris sure fooled me. I was seriously convinced he learned from his mistakes in the Wing Commander movie, and Freelancer with Microsoft in his interviews. I was even willing to overlook the woman who I suspected was the wife (thanks to said cringy video).

    @ lir big

    I never realized you were that late of a backer, even though you were aware of the project from the start. I had assumed you were a 2013 backer.

    @ Both

    We are now a happy family of Derek Smart alts or flunkies. Joined SC in different ways, but all bailed when Chris made his public statements. I would like to take a moment and brag for fun.

    “honestly I think Manzes is 2 of em Derek is 2 but the guy Mdrake I can’t work out who he is on SA, but he’s definitely a Goon”

    “…and for more entertainment visit the comments in the blog forum and behold Skippy talking to himself through an alt-account. I mean it’s so blatantly obvious, it’s not even funny… Derek, go see a therapist. A real one.”

    “It could easily be just a goon responding to him and feeding him with comments everyone knows DS uses all of the time.”

    I’m too cheap to be a goon, despite being a former Grand Admiral under the sole purpose of P2W. I love cultists and their lack of critical thinking and observation.

    #3177
    J HOW
    J HOW
    Participant

    It is worth pointing out that whilst we are finding out things and coming together and confirming tibits of information that there is a risk if we don’t confirm what we’re hearing – it could make things worse for us by accepting faux information as fact. Ideally verify your sources and if it sounds too off the wall (then again what doesn’t at CIG these days?) then they may be a reason someone has told you information. Rather to look a gift horse in the mouth than to assume false information is true.

    Let me explain:

    It had went silent at CIG Manchester and now have suddenly lit up like a Christmas tree. However I am concious some of things I’m hearing are contradicting themselves over current employee conditions and especially mentioning he whom shall not be named in the office (Hi Derek!). Now since I managed to dodge a bullet and not working for CIG and can’t directly confirm what I’m hearing. I am aware they are trying to discredit anyone associated with their idealistic vision of Star Citizen which gives us a moment of pause.

    Effectively they are trying to push false information our way to see if we pick up on it and repeat it as fact (rather than stating it’s what we heard but can’t confirm it). At the moment it seems prudent to air on the side of caution.

    If anything it proves there is something to be worried about within the project as a whole. Recommend we’re all cautious in this regard.

    #3176
    Dsmart
    dsmart
    Keymaster

    …and it’s about to get a whole lot worse. If you can imagine that.

    #3175
    Backer42 Backer42
    Backer42
    Participant

    I felt relief when I got the official statement of being released from my status as “original backer” or “citizen”. Having myself officially disassociated with the “crowdfunding movement” was much more important than the money (though it’s still nice to have it back). If one day SC members start going after each other for not spending enough money, I’m very glad that I’m not part of this anymore.

    #3174
    Lir Big
    lir big
    Participant

    @backer42 Exactly this; See shitizens, most of us didn’t know about DS but yet we were already very suspicious at CIG.
    Short story here : I’ve heard of SC back in 2012. Pledged in dec 2014 when they announced StarMarine ready for March 2015. I thought to myself they were making progress. Then well, a bit like you , I didn’t let myself beeing overwhelmed by all their bullcrap, only looking forward to hearing about star marine progress. By June 2015 I had already stated to myself this was kinda weird. Gamescon2015 help my thoughts about this beeing bullshit. DS, and TheEscapist only confirmed. Refunded by the end of October. I had the same reaction as you about CitCon 2015, any sane person would react the same way. This was absolutely fume and amateurism.

    PS : I would never have heard of DerekSmart if it was not for the WhiteKnights advertising for him on CIG forum. You guys are absolutly magic; you made more advertising for DS than anyone before.

    #3173
    Backer42 Backer42
    Backer42
    Participant

    Glad to see you got your refund early on.

    Well, it wasn’t so early on. I mostly ignored all the media buzz before fall 2015, because I had (and still have) a strict no-BS policy of only looking at the delivered downloads and make my assessments based on them. So I deliberately ignored all that video content (except a few Wingman hangars back in the old days), but I also ignored the Escapist articles. As a result of that policy I never sank into the cult.

    This was changed by  Chris Roberts himself, when he posted his “response letter” wall of text on the RSI site. This was also the first time when I heard about Derek and his example of a forced refund. That thing made me decide to watch the “CitizenCon 2015” livestream about a month later.

    Then the stream was a disaster. The first minutes were the creepiest thing I ever watched on the video game streaming site Twitch: I simply didn’t know the women who just fake-cried on stage and had no clue why she was there. This was followed by hours of false promises and the PS3-tier “Morrow tour”. The latter evidence finalized my decision to request a refund (and without Derek’s example that would have been denied). The “birthday cake” at the end wasn’t needed anymore and it was just reinforcing the decision.

    Just to clarify: It wasn’t Derek nor Goons nor “Star Citizen haters ” or anyone else, who convinced me to bail out, it was the man (CR) himself and his wife and their own actions. The same man who convinced to pledge three years earlier, back then I didn’t know anything about the shady history (http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/6.2155-54-Wing-Leader#254911). I should have done my research.

    #3172
    Starchip
    starchip
    Participant

    Now you look back… just what a shit show this thing turned into.

    #3171
    MDrake SC
    MDrake SC
    Participant

    This is a forum bug post report.

    Apparently, some of the forum structure and replies show up properly only when logged in.

    Reading the forums as a guest, results in some replies being treated as new separate posts, which makes things annoying. I just noticed it on my #3170 post responding to Backer42.

    #3170
    MDrake SC
    MDrake SC
    Participant

    I didn’t pay attention to the ED forums until Nov 2015. Probably missed all of the major rule bending and other events. On a side note, I never forgot alpha access was near $400, and thus I ignored ED.

    I was too busy fighting for my Grand Admiral (P2W combat ships) refund, and I am someone from the old RSI site. I am aware that 1500 was one of the first to make the refund denied messages public, with Derek’s help.

    Glad to see you got your refund early on. I got mine after a lot of threats. I did not have time to be polite once I suspected they would try to release something, and Derek bringing it up too also worried me.

    Also, it’s a darn shame your snarky remark was deleted. It was too much for poor mod Jenner. Who is not even willing to admit how much he actually spent.

    #3158
    Backer42 Backer42
    Backer42
    Participant

    [quote quote=3156]Not to mention baiting/harassing E:D customers on their own forums when they disagree with the crap.[/quote]

    I’m at least redpilled about those space sim communities now. Could have happened under different circumstances which a real game account at stake (I bought ED at sale, so not much loss here). But I decided to look how they deal with SC critics first, before I involve myself for real.

    Well, that ended fast.

    I got a full refund for SC thanks to man operating this site. And I was one of the first backers (day one) who helped to start this thing.

    #3157
    Backer42 Backer42
    Backer42
    Participant

    [quote quote=3155]I will give the mods some credit for allowing a good amount of criticism to go around, unlike MMORPG.[/quote]

    Well, to me it looks like they had to wait until they could construct a rule violation to make it look legit. If they could they would ban critics right away and I heard that also happened in the past. So don’t be fooled, they make it look like this, but outright delete any relevant dissent from the thread without leaving a trace.

    The first occurence was a badword filter (which I’m fine with BTW). So you self-censor yourself like expected and stay civil. But then moderation hits: On Frontier forums, you are not allowed to do that. You are not allowed to use “language” even if you don’t write it. It’s already forbidden to think it! Sounds like creepy 1984 stuff, doesn’t it? Of course, it was a remark about CIG, which was deleted, they bent the rule as excuse.

    But it was this snarky remark earned me the ban (and then got deleted of course):

    —Quote (Originally by mrsanders)—
    Well then this thread would be pretty desolate and empty since there is no game yet and not much development shown so far…
    —End Quote—
    Then just talk about Chris Roberts’ birds and how much you spent on concept sales. This is what this thread is for. Just don’t talk about Star Citizen oder Squadron 42, the company which makes it, the crowdfunding project or anything else related to it. This will get this thread locked.

    Irony is also forbidden by the forum rules and is called Public Moderation Contesting. Of course, it’s obvious the ban was for bringing up unwanted facts in the posts before, which earned over 60 reputation points for a reason, not for this remark.

    And there is the usual mess of moderators intermixing personal opinion on SC with official moderation, which is really unprofessional. One moderation post is: “Star Citizen is the greatest thing evar!” and the next one is “Please don’t discuss Glassdoor or I lock the thread”, while the forum software forces you to read every single one of them (the other shills you can easily filter out).

    #3156
    Steven Cooper
    letitfail
    Participant

    Holy shit. I clicked on the link to MaxLexandre’s profile, noted the total post count and ran the post history search.

    Literally – Thread: The Star Citizen Thread v 4 by MaxLexandre  x2000. No need to guess the thread where his first post was. An obvious shill or completionist (well maybe down to one of the ‘admiralty’) who stared at the jpegs too long.

    Seriously shitizens? You think this is ok? Going onto a CIG competitors forums then promoting your game and casting the rival game in a relatively negative light. The fact that Frontier and CIG are on ‘friendly’ terms does not make this behavior better. Not to mention baiting/harassing E:D customers on their own forums when they disagree with the crap.  I left the frontier forums a while ago but it is sad to see it struck with this infestation, when in the beginning it was an awesome place. I expect to return though shortly after Star Citizen failcascades. I will no doubt get banned, going out in a blaze of glory with humorous observations as well as by then, obvious very favorable comparisons for E:D.

    #3155
    MDrake SC
    MDrake SC
    Participant

    Yes, the ED forums must be so fun with people like Max. Can’t counter with logic and facts, go with hyperbole to bait others, and get protected by the mods. Gets interesting when the mods are also big SC spenders, but you only learn that months later, unless their names are obvious.

    Jenner is the mod that caught my eye as a “balanced” shill for quite a while.

    I will give the mods some credit for allowing a good amount of criticism to go around, unlike MMORPG.

    I wonder if MaxLexandre and Erillion are the same person. They both spend way too much time shilling SC news, and effort sniping people with the slightest valid criticism.

    FoxanotBond on ED is a suspicious shill account created pretty late. Doesn’t seem to be posting as much.

    #3154
    Starchip
    starchip
    Participant

    And don’t know where the 120M went.

    #3153
    Dsmart
    dsmart
    Keymaster

    I have heard this happen. What I think is going on is that the moderators on ED forums are heavily vested in SC. Also, since Braben and Chris are both chummy somewhat, it stands to reason that they would be quick to squash any/all dissent in that forum. And if it’s done in the ED forum, and not the general topic forum, then they need no excuse to ban people.

    #3152
    Dsmart
    dsmart
    Keymaster

    LOL! That dream already sailed.

    #3151
    Starchip
    starchip
    Participant

    Still believe in the wet dream?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L54k8BFO1f4

    #3150
    Backer42 Backer42
    Backer42
    Participant

    Hi there,

    Seems I got banned from the official Frontier forums for discussing Star Citizen in an unwanted way.

    Amusing fact: Their “volunteer moderators” seem to have sank thousands into Chris Roberts pockets. But even more amusing: Expressing concerns about SC is answered with badmouthing Frontier products using official moderator accounts on the official Frontier forums. No joke.

    Somehow Frontier put people into power, who don’t like their game and support their direct competitor. Lesson learned: If you don’t employ and pay your forum moderators, someone else is going to pay them.

    #3149
    Dsmart
    dsmart
    Keymaster

    None of that will happen. The Star Citizen IP is now toxic. Just like the Shitizen community that sprung up around it.

    I only see the following scenarios:

    1. A complete collapse in which neither Star Citizen, nor SQ42 get released. Game Over. The End.
    2. They limp along, then release SQ42 in 2017. It tanks. Game over. The End.

    There is absolutely no other scenario here.

    #3147
    Kurt Michael
    KurtM
    Participant

    So let’s enter hyper-speculative mode and discuss some ELE scenarios.

    Scenario (1) Let’s assume that by mid 2016 they run dry. Let’s assume in CIG’s favor that Squadron 42 could come out in late 2016 if they have the financing and strong management. Currently they lack both. Both can be fixed by an investor pumping in an eight-figure sum and insisting on a leadership shakeup.

    The problem is that I don’t see who should have any interest in picking up this project. Thanks to pre-payment via crowd funding there will be very little day one sales. Add the fact that Star Citizen / Squadron 42 is associated with negative news right now, which hurts sales again. The platform holders – Sony and Microsoft – wouldn’t pick this up since a) they don’t want to work with the current leadership, b) single-player games are commonly considered dead and c) a console port would be too costly and take too long. For the same reasons I can’t see a publisher pinking this one up. Nobody is longing for a story-driven, cut-scene heavy triple-AAA title right now. Not in this crowded release schedule.

    They might have an interest in picking up Star Citizen as a console-MMO, but then again Microsoft already has a space sim in the XBox One version of Elite:Dangerous and Sony will have the same soon. If they went into negotiations with CIG they would quickly realize what a mess this project is in. Not to mention the fact that the SC backers should cry foul over a console version, with SC being marketed as a hardcore PC-only experience. Even though they won’t, since they already have proven to be gullable sheep.

    In late 2017 it becomes clear that they can’t deliver Star Citizen. Sueing them is pointless though since they can use the mini-PTU as an excuse that they tried. Nobody *can* sue since class action lawsuits were ruled out in the EULA, but there will be a legal investigation. They will pay the fine and the chapter in the history books on Star Citizen can be written in late 2018.

    Scenario (2) The whole thing goes bust in late 2016 and somebody will pick up the rights from the bankruptcy assets. THQ downfall might be a reference; Gearbox picking up PC projects (Duke Nukem Forever, Aliens – Colonial Marines) and porting them to console tech (UE3 in this case) might be another; K2 picking up All Points Bulletin and Hawken might be. Hard to come up with references though, since this is all – by definition – unprecedented. But how long will the legal side take? How long did it take in the case of THQ? 12 months? 18?

    I can’t see this happening either, mostly for the reasons stated in (1). The upside of this scenario is that you could pick it up cheaper then by investment.

    Scenario (3) Alright, let’s go totally bonkers. Let’s assume that there’s some billionaire out there who just for the f*** of it pumps millions into this thing and profitability is not a concern. Now, who could it be? Hm … CryEngine … Multiplayer infrastructure … Do I hear Lumberyard? Do I hear Jeff Bezos? Port everything over to AWS, eight year dev cost of maybe 200 $Mio and release in 2019? As a Lumberyard showcase? You heard it here first folks, you heard it here first 🙂

    #3145
    Dsmart
    dsmart
    Keymaster

    No. If the project folds, they will file for bankruptcy. Then everything gets sold. I don’t envision any circumstance whereby any of this project ends up in the public domain.

    #3144
    Tenandra
    Tenandra
    Participant

    One thing for sure is that the in game store for “non P2w” content will work smoothly when the minimum viable product is released in fact that might be what they mean that might be all that works smoothly…

Viewing 32 replies - 33 through 64 (of 154 total)

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